Oh, … My favorite is the .625″ at the gas “pencil” (pick your barrel length). It makes even the newer Mini-14 seem inaccurate by comparison. 20' AR-15 AR15 barrel kit includes barrel, handguards, gas tube, delta ring, front sight assembly and flash hider. From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. What I found was a mound of bullet jacket material at their gas ports. and a G7 ballistic coefficient, this means a 20″ rifle will get the bullet going fast enough to fragment reliably to 125m and sorta-reliably to 160m. Engineer types might appreciate that. (Note: I DO NOT recommend conducting an assault with bayoneted, empty, rifles, as was done several times in WWI!) As best as I can tell, not only didn’t they solve a real problem, they didn’t even solve the pretend problem. So the Logisitcs people had “Barrels Bending” on their list of “M16A1” things to “Improve” right after listing “Handguards Breaking.”. Like I said — yesterday was a long day. Aero Precision (manufacturers of my favorite stripped uppers & lowers) acquired Ballistic Advantage in the end of 2014. The best point to pin a barrel is not at all, i.e., the floated barrel fixes all of that. And for us civilians using soft or poly tip ammo moves fragmentation velocity down to the low 1k range (arfcom has a good summary chart somewhere on that — I’m not an arfcommer). Caliber: 5.56mm NATO Barrel Length: 11.5" Twist Rate: 1:7 Muzzle Thread: 1?2x28 TPI (Threads Per Inch) Material: Chrome Moly Vanadium Outside Finish: Mil-Spec Heavy Phosphate Inside Finish: Chrome Gas System: Carbine Length Diameter At Gas Port: .750 Barrel Extension: A4 Barrel Profile: Government … For shooters looking for an SPR barrel, the barrel is lighter than full HBAR profiles and has plenty of accuracy for precision shooting. That would have been because of a change in barrel harmonics due to being pinned at the wrong point. I hope the British government decorated those brave men, not just for defeating a more-numerous enemy force who had the advantage of surprise, but for doing it largely with bayoneted SA80 bull-pup rifles. Scuttlebutt was, in the 80’s when the M16 A2 was adopted, that the reason the main barrel remained thin was to mount the M203. I also like Vltor clamp on gas blocks protected under a free float handguard on a precision build. Next Level sought out a manufacturer to meet those demands. Matt Bracken – Whoops, left out — big fan of your books. My grandfather was a Green Beret and A-Camp Team Leader within miles of both the DMZ and Laos, near Khe Sanh… Combat disabled before John Wayne’s movie ever hit theaters. Third, if you believe the problem is that Soldiers or Marines are using their rifles to pry open boxes or crates, then teach them not to do that. So we went with this “improvement.”. The best research I can find on why such a thing exists shows the idea to be extremely dumb. for all the money spent to bring those guns to field? While everything stated in the article above may well be true, I do not believe that the government profile barrel is “dumb.” The increased thickness beyond the front sight block dampens barrel harmonics, and reduces deflection from sling tension, making the weapon more accurate. Tapered profile out front, for easier maneuverability. Your next qualification score will be the LAST thing on your mind! And Palmetto offers a pencil nitride .625 gas block assembled midlength upper for somewhere between $180 and $230 IIRC, and is a great first foray into a lighter weight upper if you’re interested in trying. AR-15 lore tells us that GIs were using their rifles as pry bars to open crates, and they were bending the barrels by the muzzle doing it. So we made that part of the barrel thicker because we did not want the excess weight of a full length heavy barrel. I have had unbelievable success with the DD pencil barrels. On May 13, 2019 at 8:46 am, Herschel Smith said: If you saw a change in POI, that wouldn’t have been because of barrel deflection or bending. This 5.56 chambered 12.5 inch Government Profile Modern Series Barrel is machined from 4150 Chrome Moly Vanadium steel with a QPQ Corrosion Resistant Finish and QPQ coated M4 feed ramp extension. Just sayin. said: The Army published Training Circular (TC) 23-11 in about 1981, in which The Army Research Institute (ARI) published results of their rifle marksmanship studies conducted over the previous several years. Faxon also has precision profile barrels that are fluted w/ 5R rifling that weigh similar to BA, but are something like 30% more expensive IIRC. Some years ago he shared the story of the government profile barrel on AR-15.com. Check great and honest reviews! BSF Barrels – AR-15 Barrel Carbon Fiber 223 Wylde 1-8 Twist. You can prove this by comparing the AR platform to the Mini-14. As with all machines they have their own set of critical parameters, but those aren’t that hard to define or to satisfy. I’ve reviewed several of their barrels over the years and really like their stuff for the price point. As to the burr at the port: A fellow once asked a premium barrel maker (Krieger if I recall correctly) how they managed to drill their gas port in the groove rather than a land & be so clean about it. Our 16” 5.56 barrel is the most accurate and longest lasting barrel attainable for your AR-15 build. This is easier to achieve with a tapered barrel and easiest to achieve with a barrel of a constant (bull) profile. Next Level chose this barrel after evaluating several options. Second, engineering resources would have performed a failure mode and effects analysis of the problem. That’s stupid. When we removed this “mound”, the barrels would all pass the Drop Gauge. Milspec isn’t better. …There is so much idiocy talked about guns it’s nearly unbelievable. The second law of thermodynamics says that entropy always increases. All of that being said. muzzle velocity as compared to M193, plus it overall seems to be more stable in tissue and does not yaw and fragment as reliably as M193, for reasons not fully understood (speculation currently revolves around rifling twist and bullet construction). It shoots accurate enough and has never malfunctioned on me no matter what I’ve fed it. -Mini-14s was more to do w/ barrel profile PLUS piston-system than barrel profile alone. Right to Bear is pleased to offer you the Ballistic advantage 14.5-inch govt profile barrel (model #: BABL556010M), a U.S.-made quality barrel with a concentric design. The only thing that comes to mind is, prison time! I have some experience with the Government-Issue items.). Never used it to pry open a case of 5.56, a Mermite can or anything else for that matter. To demonstrate a variety of options, we obtained four identical standard 16-inch mid-length gas system barrels with government profiles (and 0.750-inch gas block) from Bravo Company USA. It’s great when people do the design based off half-baked ideas of what the problem is, and do the research only after design is complete and submitted. The 20” format provides some noted benefits when mobility isn’t your primary concern. Since WW-2, bayonet charges have been about as pointless as cavalry charges in WW-1, especially if against peer forces. Your statement is almost 100% correct, but not quite. @Papa, it depends on what you want to do with it. Profile is a way to describe how thick the barrel. Accuracy is a matter of timing the bullet exit so the barrel is in the same spot (or close) in its vibrational movement when the bullet exits the barrel every time. Regardless, I’m always impressed when someone demonstrates they know the difference between affect and effect. So I don’t see a lot of benefit to the average shooter beyond benchrest/precision competition use… YMMV. With a 14.5″ barrel like an M4, 80/115. not cleaning up the burr correctly. The Marines were the driving factor in the adjustable rear sights of the M16A2 as well. Below 2550 f.p.s. Many of the barrels sold now (and PSA sells container-ship loads of them) are “A2 profile.” On a gun whose role is one where ‘handy’ is in the job description, they are a beast, solution in search of a problem. had to qualify right after chow. He was later the VP for Military Operations at Knights Armament Company. Ther… A government profile AR-10.308 barrel presents a fairly uniform diameter, this gives you the luxury of quite a number of choices for which handguard to use. thank god for the aftermarket! Both my M1A and G.I. The highest bending moment in a cantilever beam will be where it is pinned, which in this case will be at the receiver. Most discussions around profile revolve around the 5.56 variants, but different profiles may apply to different calibers as well. On May 13, 2019 at 2:10 pm, Cold Warrior said: Interesting read, thank you. We had 1 day to zero and qualify This is the one that Lt. Col Lutz ascribed to, at least somewhat. (maker dependent) & balancing much better in hand. Accuracy is a matter of timing the bullet exit so the barrel is in the same spot (or close) in its vibrational movement when the bullet exits the barrel every time. On May 13, 2019 at 8:16 am, Dean M Drews said: I totally agree. BA’s fluted SPRs (also in 16″ length) are also a great options for precision builds. and then he and then another both spent some time firing it and then went to the armorers people think twice about grabbing a knife..for some reason grabbing a shotgun barrel, not so much. Just ask those terrified Iraqi irregulars, who fled at the sight of those British bayonets! Other posts since my previous: The original 20.5″ pencil barrel was, as I have been informed by folks who fought in Nam, specifically designed to get the full 3,250 fps out of 55 grain M-193, which was designed to tumble and break into pieces at that speed on hitting enemies. ….Mein Got, you’d think we were dealing with Black Magic the way some people talk. (I carried M16A1s from 1970-1998, when I finally got the -A2, then carried M4s in Afghanistan and Iraq. On May 13, 2019 at 9:11 pm, Anonymous said: This varies with manufacturer, production lot, and so on, due to differences in jacket thickness, jacket material, and cannelure pattern, but as a general rule of thumb, the 5.56mm M193 bullet tumbles and fragments in soft tissue with near 100% reliability down to 2700 f.p.s. Jarhead logik. If you’re hiding in thick cover and your opponent sends a dog after you, it’s the ideal tool for dispatching the animal without firing a shot and betraying your position. And the top end AR-15 manufacturers need to get away from fabricating “government profile” barrels. These improved profile barrels also allow one to run lighter stocks like BCM or B5 Bravo vs the heavier magpul ACS-L, etc, that best balance the gov’t profile barreled weapons — lighter stocks keep improved balance intact. Or gut them with your bayoneted-rifle before they can do the same to you? The Government Profile Barrel Fix We “experts” thought this bending was from rough handling like during bayonet drills, etc., as an absence of any mid-barrel handguard damage in these rifles made one assume the fulcrum of such bending was the bayonet lug. All the more so when a Soldier adds IR/Visual lasers & lights on it. BTW…I never had an issue with my iron sight equipped M16a1 accurately hitting 300m + targets. Some are even up to 12 pounds with a scope and weighted stock. -As civilians w/o airlift, etc, backstops, if you’re to a point of a bayonet charge, you’re best to retreat/strategic withdraw and fight another day than go down in a blaze of glory. Another is that they liked to reach out and grab vines and branches, not an ideal feature while patrolling in a jungle! That lightweight barrel, now commonly called the A1 or “pencil” barrel, was good for snapping off single shots but not as good for full-auto shooting.At the request of the Marines the M16A2 was given a chromed bore and a heavier barrel profile forward of the gas block, mainly to minimize the chance of bending (one of the A1’s most common failures in close combat). Faxonstarted off as aerospace parts manufacturers so they got their stuff and tolerances down. It isn’t a shovel, it isn’t a hammer, it isn’t a pry bar, and as for bayonet charges, you’re not going to do one. Some might say there is no excuse for this, ever, but in the middle of a firefight when you are being overrun, for sure soldiers will open those crates the fastest way possible, and future bent barrels be damned. With a muzzle velocity of around 3240 f.p.s. I can totally relate to- I thought the Gov profile was dumb on the face of it from the first moment. I remember that a switch to the heavy barrel was to alleviate that.. Unless something more specific needed I’ll be going “pencil” every time. AR15.COM is the world’s largest firearm community and is a gathering place for firearm enthusiasts of all types. ! Why not issue one of those small, flat, light-weight prybars that are made for the job of opening crates, and useful for many others? Ask your Marine son about the Battle of Bloody Ridge on Guadalcanal, or any of the dozens of other close-range engagements Marines fought against fanatical Japanese forces in the Solomon Islands or on New Guinea. As has been previously noted, fixing bayonets gives a psychological advantage to the ones who are willing to close with and kill with a “spear-tipped” rifle. Milspec isn’t worse. And to echo others, properly profiled barrels completely change the handling and balance of the AR15. check out the. SOP during those fights was that every Marine had a bayonet affixed to his rifle (whether it was a Springfield M1903 or an M-1 Garand) anytime they were on alert. Overall, this barrel should be suitable for any task you could throw at it. The new technical data package was already written and put into effect. We “experts” thought this bending was from rough handling like during bayonet drills, etc., as an absence of any mid-barrel handguard damage in these rifles made one assume the fulcrum of such bending was the bayonet lug. There are cludges and work-arounds, but none very good for a carbine-length gas system and 16-inch barrel. As for guys using their rifles as prybars, you still had leftovers of McNamara’s 100,000 in place, so stupid human tricks are gonna be a lot more frequent. On May 13, 2019 at 9:10 am, Herschel Smith said: Many times writing professional papers editors want me to use the word “effect,” claiming that the word “affect” is used more in an emotive connotation. It all started with a drop gauge test. If you want a mid-length 14.5 barrel that has all the right stuff, this is the one. ! What is a recommended barrel profile for 16-20″ AR/M16’s? Pencil barrel stress and heat zero testing. are still putting “government profile” barrels on their guns. Nope. So I don’t see a lot of benefit to the average shooter beyond benchrest/precision competition use… YMMV. I told the DI If this is the hottest area of a barrel, a government profile barrel seems to make less sense. You about summed up the idiocy of the government profile barrel. On May 15, 2019 at 11:15 am, DAN III said: Much better to make them dead at 200 yards or 100 yards than to have to get up close and personal. Heat causes degradation of accuracy, so a heavier profile barrel is typically more accurate when shooting repeatedly. Shop TRYBE Defense 10.5 in Government Profile AR Pistol Barrel, 9mm | 33% Off 4 Star Rating on 2 Reviews for TRYBE Defense 10.5 in Government Profile AR Pistol Barrel, 9mm + Free Shipping over $49. Plenty of long-barreled AR-15 are capable of this level of accuracy, but they all weigh in North of 7 pounds. It does sustained fire quite well (FA mag dumps not tested) and even with a 5 oz light & mount on the nose handles wonderfully. Korea vet and most of his SF service was in Germany/Eastern Europe… CAR-15s were common among US SF at his time in Vietnam and M1 carbines for the indigs…. In testing using the bayonet lug as a fulcrum, and applying calibrated mechanical pressure to the muzzle, the new barrel was about 9 times more resistant to bend and take a set than an M16A1 profile. Talk about a tough job! **And on last point, meant medivac rather than airlift… Long day. Realizing that the “solution” they presented didn’t actually solve a problem, they tried to course correct. I could be wrong on that – but that was the longstanding explanation we received as to why the whole damn barrel wasn’t the thicker, heavier profile. https://youtu.be/beaBDC8iS-E. On May 13, 2019 at 8:30 pm, The Wretched Dog said: Not withstanding anything written above, to what extent did the first 60% of the ‘government profile’ barrel remain ‘thin’ so as to be able to mount the M203 grenade launcher – without changing the mounting hardware? 1. You want this barrel, really, if you want a barrel that you can take anywhere, this is the one. Broke the blade of that Ka-Bar right in half ! On May 13, 2019 at 10:36 am, brunop said: There are many good barrel makers out there. Next Level NLX 308 Government Profile Barrel. Colt listened, and even put out civilian M16A2 copies that still had the standard lightweight profile. It is, quite correctly stated, dumb. Regardless, w/ modern powders you DO NOT need 20″ of barrel in order to achieve full velocity. The Army wanted a heavier barrel for improved accuracy (no intent to get into the merits of that solution), but had to accept making only the front portion of the barrel, outside the handguards so as to be compatible with the M203. Ballistic Advantage’s AR15 16-inch barrel is a perfect choice for a long rifle that needs to be dependable, and accurate. While everything stated in the article above may well be true, I do not believe that the government profile barrel is “dumb.” The increased thickness beyond the front sight block dampens barrel harmonics, and reduces deflection from sling tension, making the weapon more accurate. This is easier to achieve with a tapered barrel and easiest to achieve with a barrel of a constant (bull) profile. -Get a middleweight rifle and A2 front sight and your bayonet is again in the correct position. Edged weapons have an outsized psychological impact upon the soldier, indeed upon almost all human beings, far in excess of their actual effectiveness on the battlefield. I thought the pencil profile would sacrifice accuracy for some reason. as far as possible and was still about 6 inches high and 3 inches left. Colonel, US Army (Retired) trailer. at that price they could have the finest aftermarket guns available. Your rifle isn’t a spear.”. From hunters and military members, to competition shooters and general firearm enthusiasts, we welcome anyone who values and respects the way of the firearm. If you think I wrong or don’t know the full history of government profile barrels, you can weigh in with comments. I read the Marines are paying H&K $3500 a copy for the M27. All their barrels are made in-house from “cradle to grave.” Plus they also supply lightweight barrels to a lot of other brands…shhhhhh. 14.5" Mid Length Government Profile VooDoo Barrel AR15 AR-15. Milspec means that something was fabricated and built according to a specification, nothing more and nothing less. Fatigue, metal lattice stretching and deformation, metal creep, rust, corrosion and a host of other problems will affect any machine. They obviously never got real engineers involved in this problem. 0-300 w/ a 100 yard zero are nearly identical. On May 14, 2019 at 6:47 pm, SGM Settles (Ret.) Discretion being the better part of valor, etc. If you want the solid dependability of a government profile barrel in 14.5 or 10.5-inch lengths, we have them too. I have started eyeing my Gov’t profile barrels suspiciously. They’re dumb. With the problem solved, the new barrel design went into effect. You are correct about the bayonet insofar as the fact that modern armies have largely moved away from their use and no longer teach bayonet skills as a significant part of hand-to-hand/close-quarters battle doctrine. I like the 16″ midlengths w/ .750 gas block journal diameter for higher rates of fire, or the .625 journal version where weight reduction is paramount. Honestly looking for some opinions. Del-Ton, Inc AR-15 AR15 20' pre-ban barrel Government Profile kit. Saves more than a pound vs unfluted IIRC and increases rate of cooling. The problem with longer barrels is that they result in reduced accuracy, albeit higher velocities. Perfect as a replacement barrel for your target or hunting rifle, it is legal for use in New York State. This barrel is in the style of the original A2 government profile 20” barrel except that the muzzle is turned with a competition crown. On May 13, 2019 at 10:15 am, MTHead said: Interesting that the problem was sloppy port drilling. Thomas Jefferson, MISC Training Course Announcements & AAR's, Former Vickers Shooting Method Regional Instructors, Pacific Northwest Training and Networking, All Other Longgun Parts, Accessories, & Magazines (EE), Handgun Parts, Accessories & Magazines (EE), If this is your first visit, be sure to I have had unbelievable success with the problem was sloppy port drilling and effect AR! Handguards isn ’ t do anything to dampen harmonics, in fact thickened barrel. Kings at 300 yards from a bench problem was sloppy port drilling and... 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